Web-Lisp? Oh no!

Fare Rideau rideau@ens.fr
Thu, 1 May 1997 01:35:53 +2600 (MET DST)

>>: Fare Rideau <rideau@ens.fr>
>: <df@sdf.saomai.org>

>> The web is a bad joke at both a document specification and
>> a document retrieval system (sure better than nothing, though,
>> much like a free Unix is better than no free OS).
> Which brings up something I've been fantasizing about: we need to
> replace HTTP/HTML.  Is anyone interested in devloping a document
> specification and transport system that isn't based on some unix
> weenie's diseased nightmare?
I think there's already the DSSSL.
Else, there's the Tunes Migration subproject.
Lisp can be used to specify documents much better than anything else
our Lisp code transport system could then be used to transport
documents as Lisp code. See also the Scheme/Postscript project,
where they take all the postscript primitives,
and replace the braindead Postscript core language by Scheme.

> And hopefully one that could be
> "plugged-in" to Internet Exploder/Netscrape so the toothless masses can
> adapt easily, and therefore give it a REAL chance to take over the WWW?
Anything can be plugged in to them,
and there if we bring the right thing,
there will always be browseroids to add it to their crappy software.

> The WWW is a neat idea.
The WWW is a dumb implementations of neat ideas that came long before.
The neat ideas were given by people like Vannevar Bush in the 40's
and Ted Nelson since the 70s (or more?). They are still not implemented. See

> If we fight the battle on ALL fronts, we might actually change the
> course of the computer industry.
Of course we will. Let's just not fight all fronts at the same time.
Let's focus on the essentials first.

>> But again, if we focus on good code and clean design instead of marketing,
>> then we shall overcome.
> I think you are wrong.  Moreover, I think Symbolics, Thinking Machines,
> and Xerox -prove- you are wrong.  Good code and clean design, despite the
> best wishes of you and me and millions of other people, simply does -not-
> seem to be enough.
To me these are not failure of good software, but
1) of hardware-based solutions
2) of proprietary software
(not to talk about any further stupid management).
However, our project is
1) a software solution
2) free software
So that anyone can freely use it on cheap/existing hardware.
Be sure that if we provide good code, there will be more than enough
marketroids to invent the most possible nice names for our LispOS,
and package it into luser-friendly distributions.
They are already getting trained with Linux, BTW.

> As much as I hate the twisted world of marketing, I think it is a game
> we have to play in order to win in the Industry.
False! The scarce resource isn't marketing.
The scarce resource is good code and clean design.
If we are a free software project, we don't have to do marketing,
just to use, say, the GPL. Again, see Linux.
Linus never had to hype us with marketing stuff.
Others would do it for him.

== Fare' -- rideau@ens.fr -- Franc,ois-Rene' Rideau -- DDa(.ng-Vu~ Ba^n ==
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