[unios] Re: Generic Design

[Anders Petersson]

From: Anders Petersson <anders.petersson@mbox320.swipnet.se>

At 20:03 1998-12-10 , you wrote:
>From: Pieter Dumon <Pieter.Dumon@rug.ac.be>
>
>> Yes, but Posix does not say that data files could possibly contain code to
>> allow native manipulation of the data without having the original
program, you
>> can't do that with a generic file, as it is a static piece of data to be
>> manipulated by a program... this was implied in the design.
>It's much easier to provide with the files a program to handle the file
>(object) and then we're in POSIX again. Whaty's the great thing about
>POSIX /Unix ? You can make a chain of all very flexible, powerfull and
>small utilities and let this operate on one or more files or other
>resource how you want.(Pipes!)

The same thing would be possible with my model, and even to a higher
degree. Since objects can support many formats (just add an interface for
each format), it would be possible to read HTML files or Word files as
usual text files - and the one who's reading doesn't have to add support
for it in any way. If you have a list object type, you can take the output
of one program and feed it - in the form of a list - to another program.
Everything that can be done by piping in Unix can be done just as good with
my method, and often better.

>> but I can't say it's just Posix with a different name...
>I'm not saying it's POSIX, I'm saying it can be done more effectively,
>more powerfully and more flexibly with POSIX. Add the power of X to
>this... 

Add the power of *my GUI* to what I've said, and I think it would well
out-weight Unix power/flexibility.
You seem to defend Unix vigorously... you tell me what you're missing in
Unix, and how you think UniOS could be made better, more flexible, more
powerful, etc.

> There are
>> some critical differences, and advantages with this system, over Posix.
Posix
>> does not deal with objects, and methods, it has only files... Objects can
>> perform complex interconnect hierarchies of data exchange, without special
>> programs to do so.
>
>They do need code to do so, only it's inside them and private to the file!

Yes, objects need their OHs. However, OHs work without any intervention
from the client application or the kernel. The true complexity of the
objects are hidden. Compare with the concepts of locality and information
hiding in OOP.

>> 
>> That's why we have to think of new things... I do believe the idea
presented
>> was a step in the right direction towards finding a _NEW_ system. The only
>> other system I have in mind is neural... and I sure as hell don't have the
>> design experience or the proper knowledge to be able to implement or design
>> such a system... But it would be another possibility.... :)  Maybe I will
>> think more about it...
>
>Neural systems are found to be rather unpowerfull on todays computers.

In addition, neural systems do not work in a way that is good for most
computer tasks today. They work more like the human brain - associative,
unexact.

>I'm not recommending to adopt POSIX or anything. But I still claim it's
>the most powerfull OS "shell" (litteraly) we have. Win32 is nioce, but
>not portable. But, indeed, POSIX could need some enhancements. I'll think
>about this. The ease of Win32 is that the graphical UI is part of the API.

The trumph card of my model is that there are not much of necessary APIs.
Most of the interfaces on a standard system lays outside the static part
(the kernel). Since it all follows a relevant logic, GUIs and other
constructs fit well into it, without being implemented or even planned for
in the beginning.
The same thing that makes win32 easy (the UI built-in), makes it
unflexible. In the same way, my design is very flexible. If a standard UI
interface is worked out, I don't think anything would be sacrified.

binEng

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